THIS AIN'T NO DONKEY SHOW!

March 3rd Sweat

2008-03-04T15:21:00.000-08:00

Group sweat was narrowed down to just me (LuckySOB) and Dice this weeak. Dodgy is on his Great American Adventure and Noel was busy forgeting. Anyway, I put in some time 3 tabling the 400nl games on UB. It seemed that the main focus of the sweat was an area I think Dice has advanced skills at and I need a lot of work on still. Getting more value out of my hands was that subject.

In this first hand this was the third time this villian had donk lead into me he was playing 82/35.

SB $307
BB $751
UTG $449
CO $398
Hero on BTN $949

Preflop: (5 players) Hero on BTN with 6c 5c
Folded to Hero who raises to $14 SB calls BB folds

This is a standard open for me when folded to on the BTN.

Flop: 2h 5h Qc (2 players, $32)
SB bets $21 Hero calls

This guy has been donk leading a lot and I have no reason to think I'm not ahead here, but I don't want to play a big pot or get him to fold, so easy call.

Turn: 2d (2 players, $74)
SB checks Hero checks

Checking behind for same reason I'm not raising the best hand on flop. And will often induce a bluff on river here.

River: 9d (2 players, $74)
SB bets $22 Hero calls

He now bets $22 which is less than 1/3 pot and I'm never folding to this bet, I still think I have best hand here, but I'm given such great odds. The way this guy plays, always leading I think he bets turn with any pair or draw, so he either has complete air or a 9 that hit, but even then I think he bets more. Never not calling this.

Villian shows As 8d for Ace high, Hero wins $115 with pair of 5's.

Hand 2

SB $455
BB $528
UTG $206
MP $636
Hero on CO $501
BTN $696

The main focus on this hand is the river bet for value.

Preflop: (6 players) Hero is CO with Kc Jh
Folded to MP raises to $14, Hero calls, folded around.

This player was on 2 of my tables and playing around 31/26 so his opening range is light enough to call here with position.

Flop: Kh 4h 5c (2 players $34)
MP bets $28 Hero calls

No reason to raise here no reason to fold, standard call.

Turn: Js (2 players $90)
MP bets $64 Hero calls

No reason to raise here no reason to fold, standard call.

River: Qs (2 players $218)
MP checks, Hero bets $170, MP thinks long and calls

The key here is to bet an amount that looks opposite of what we want. If I want a call for value it would seem standard to bet small, but if we took this line with a flush draw and missed feeling we can only win by betting, we would bet large to get him off his hand. Knowing he's a thinking player enough to understand that, we bet the amount that looks more like the bluff so he will make his hero call.

MP shows Qd 9d, Hero wins $554 pot.

The bet amount I expect to get a call on changes based the type of player. You need to understand the level your opponent is thinking on and use it against him.

Hand 3

SB $409
BB $400
UTG $286
MP $400
CO $407
Hero is BTN $493

Preflop: (6 players) Hero is BTN with Ad Tc
UTG limps, MP and CO fold, Hero raises to $18, Blinds fold UTG calls.

Standard PFR, UTG is 43/8.

Flop: (2 players, $42) 2d 5s 2s
UTG checks BTN checks

Cbetting never folds out anything here except worse hands.

Turn: (2 players, $42) 9s
UTG bets $29 Hero calls

This type of player always reads a flop check behind as weakness and there's no reason to just give up here as he'll bet with anything here. Will see how river comes down.

River: (2 players, $100) Th
UTG bets $47 Hero calls $47

Same as turn, no reason to think I'm not best now but no reason to rasie here, so standard call.

UTG shows Kd 4d, Hero wins $199.

Group sweat

2008-02-27T12:30:00.000-08:00

I was coming off a 7 hour day at the tables and definately not on my A-game. During the sweat I told Martin and Jason how i would probably shut down if we werent sweating. The reason I am writing this isnt because I spewed a shit ton of chips its simply because i think this is many gridners weakness. We plan a session and things start off crap and we dont quit. If you cant identify mini tilt and quit or correct it you are going to have some very spewy sessions imo. Enough preaching, read the hands bitches!

Hand 1: Thin value FTW. Villain in the hand was running some real nitty TAG numbers like 18/15/1 at the time. When he c/c the turn his hand looks like a weak made hand like a PP or T9 which we are ahead of most the time. Granted he had a low AF we can assume all OP DB and possibly even AXcc. On the river we missed value by not betting is the group consensus. Basically our range is nuts or northing here and we should get looked up much lighter then often based on this.

Full Tilt Poker, $1/$2 NL Hold'em Cash Game, 6 Players
LeggoPoker.com Hand History Converter

BB: $234
UTG: $179.60
MP: $369.25
CO: $214.95
Hero (BTN): $274.55
SB: $198

Pre-Flop: Jc Jh dealt to Hero (BTN)
UTG raises to $7, 2 folds, Hero calls $7, 2 folds

Flop: ($17) 7d 9h 2c (2 Players)
UTG bets $14, Hero calls $14

Turn: ($45) 7c (2 Players)
UTG checks, Hero bets $28, UTG calls $28

River: ($101) Qs (2 Players)
UTG checks, Hero checks

Results: $101 Pot ($3 Rake)
UTG showed As Ad (two pair, Aces and Sevens) and WON $98 (+$49 NET)
Hero showed Jc Jh (two pair, Jacks and Sevens) and LOST (-$49 NET)

Hand 2: Thin value FTW take two. This guy was a spew tard who had shown a propensity to c/c with all sort of shite. Checking the turn back is horrible in our opinion. We lose so much value from all his weaker made hands/draws and we allow way to many hands that could improve his holding peel off. When he fires the river weak we called based on prior reads where he bluffed the river small.

Full Tilt Poker, $1/$2 NL Hold'em Cash Game, 6 Players
LeggoPoker.com Hand History Converter

BTN: $200
SB: $198
BB: $396.40
UTG: $214.50
Hero (MP): $235.55
CO: $200

Pre-Flop: 7d 7h dealt to Hero (MP)
UTG calls $2, Hero raises to $9, 4 folds, UTG calls $7

Flop: ($21) 9h 6h 9s (2 Players)
UTG checks, Hero bets $15, UTG calls $15

Turn: ($51) Td (2 Players)
UTG checks, Hero bets $27, UTG calls $27

River: ($105) 5s (2 Players)
UTG bets $25, Hero calls $25

Results: $155 Pot ($3 Rake)
UTG showed Qc Qs (two pair, Queens and Nines) and WON $152 (+$76 NET)
Hero mucked 7d 7h 7d 7h (two pair, Nines and Sevens) and LOST (-$76 NET)

Hand 3: If you bet it you will know. Thin value FTW take three. OK so really this is thin value/where am I. Villain is 19/16/3. The group felt the turn was a spot where we are betting for value as a larger part of his range could peel here and if raised we can fold without question. After heated debate and further analysis I feel the turn is a check. It seems imo that his weak holdings cant stand a DB but they may bluff the river or look us up lighter because we checked it back on the turn. Please comment on this hand.

Full Tilt Poker, $1/$2 NL Hold'em Cash Game, 6 Players
LeggoPoker.com Hand History Converter

BB: $257.15
UTG: $247.40
MP: $62.60
CO: $307.35
Hero (BTN): $200
SB: $197

Pre-Flop: 9d Kc dealt to Hero (BTN)
3 folds, Hero raises to $7, SB folds, BB calls $5

Flop: ($15) 6d 9h Tc (2 Players)
BB checks, Hero bets $12, BB calls $12

Turn: ($39) 3c (2 Players)
BB checks, Hero bets $26, BB raises to $52, Hero folds

Results: $91 Pot ($3 Rake)
BB mucked and WON $88 (+$43 NET)

Hand 4: Thin value? Sorry not an option. This was early on and though we had started the session LAG there is no value in 4 betting as best case scenario is a flip. Also with position we can take the flop and play poker which is fun. Flop isnt horrible and we are obligated to call. On the turn betting is horrible as we get value from nothing we are ahead of, villains range to c/c or crai is AQ, QQ+. By the river it is quite obvious we are best but doubtful we can extract value from worse. A bet here might be ok but the info gained by seeing his whole cards rather then betting and having him fold is more valuable i believe.

FullTiltPoker Game #5398780128: Table Bonanza (6 max) - $1/$2 - No Limit Hold'em - 18:14:00 ET - 2008/02/25
Seat 1: sockervadd ($225.40)
Seat 2: DinoDino76 ($183.60)
Seat 3: JxMxC ($359.95)
Seat 4: adonis999 ($245.15)
Seat 5: Life_Heater ($200)
Seat 6: Spear1 ($203.10)
Spear1 posts the small blind of $1
sockervadd posts the big blind of $2
The button is in seat #5
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to Life_Heater [Js Jh]
DinoDino76 folds
JxMxC folds
adonis999 folds
Life_Heater raises to $7
Spear1 raises to $26
sockervadd folds
Life_Heater calls $19
*** FLOP *** [3d Qh 7h]
Spear1 bets $38
Life_Heater has 15 seconds left to act
Life_Heater calls $38
*** TURN *** [3d Qh 7h] [9d]
Spear1 checks
Life_Heater has 15 seconds left to act
Life_Heater checks
*** RIVER *** [3d Qh 7h 9d] [7c]
Spear1 checks
Life_Heater has 15 seconds left to act
Life_Heater has requested TIME
Life_Heater checks
*** SHOW DOWN ***
Spear1 shows [8c 8h] two pair, Eights and Sevens
Life_Heater shows [Js Jh] two pair, Jacks and Sevens
Life_Heater wins the pot ($127) with two pair, Jacks and Sevens
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot $130 Rake $3
Board: [3d Qh 7h 9d 7c]
Seat 1: sockervadd (big blind) folded before the Flop
Seat 2: DinoDino76 didn't bet (folded)
Seat 3: JxMxC didn't bet (folded)
Seat 4: adonis999 didn't bet (folded)
Seat 5: Life_Heater (button) showed [Js Jh] and won ($127) with two pair, Jacks and Sevens
Seat 6: Spear1 (small blind) showed [8c 8h] and lost with two pair, Eights and Sevens

The UF2B cares!

2008-02-22T15:51:00.000-08:00

This is a poker story. A story of caring. When us Mid to High stakes players are tired or bored and dont feel like grinding our regular games it can be entertaining to drop down a few limits and just get nuts. Last night was one of those ocassions.

I(peten2toms) was donking up some 50NL which I mentioned to Dodgy. I also mentioned how this Lag tard was giving me fits aswell. Dodgy decided to join the table and have some fun too. We were going ape in chat and just splashing chips around. The Lag was ending his session and announced it. Two hands before his blinds Dodgy stacks him for 200BB. I know from personal experience just how bent I would be if I was villain. At this time Dodgy suggests HU which the donk happily agrees to.

Now the fun really begins. They were playing two tables of 50NL which is so minus EV for Dodgy it isnt even funny. Dodgy proceeds to stack donk 3 more times in under 20 minutes and sits out. As the HU match was taking place Dodgy decided to announce that he was a HS player by sitting at a large BI HU table and inviting the donk to join.

Why the UF2B cares? You might be saying; "What assholes!" Yes we stacked a Lag tard who some day might be a good mid stakes player. Yes we sat out after sucking out set vs combo draw. But, Dodgy the HS baller that he is, mainly for shits and giggles, opted to transfer homeboy his monies back. How sick is that? You are grindign 50NL and get destroyed by a HS baller. Then you wake up the next day with more money in your account then before. Plus an email informing you that the asshole who pwned you has transfered you funds. Sweet story to tell your poker pals.

Dice14 600NL FTP

2008-02-18T19:15:00.000-08:00

This week I played three tables of 600NL on FTP. Not too many crazy spots, but a couple of small interesting ones.

1) Full Tilt Poker, $3/$6 NL Hold'em Cash Game, 5 Players

UTG: $905
CO: $753
Hero (BTN): $670
SB: $603
BB: $232.25

Pre-Flop: 6 5 dealt to Hero (BTN)
UTG folds, CO raises to $21, Hero calls $21, SB folds, BB calls $15

Based on game flow, this can either be three bet or cold called. I opted to call because I had been actively three betting villain during the session.

Flop: ($66) 7 3 A (3 Players)
BB checks, CO bets $48, Hero raises to $150, 2 folds

Very dry flop. When villain cbets into a multiway pot, his cbetting range becomes narrower than if it were a heads up pot. Villain knows that I understand this. When I raise in this spot, I am suggesting significant strength because he is cbetting into a multiway pot (where his perceived range is narrow) and I raise with someone yet to act. I wasnt too concerned with the BB bc he was a LAP donk. Villain is a very aggro player so Id expect him to cbet this dry board with his entire preflop range a good portion of the time. Even if he has AJ+ (the top of his range), he'll most likely call and check the turn, effectively buying me a free river. One could make an argument for floating here, but against an aggro opponent I would expect him to double barrel a good portion of the time because he will often put me on a weak to marginal ace that cant stand much heat.

Results: $162 Pot ($3 Rake)
Hero mucked 6 5 and WON $159 (+$90 NET)

2. These two hands illustrate an important concept for a thinking player.

Full Tilt Poker, $3/$6 NL Hold'em Cash Game, 6 Players

UTG: $303.35
MP: $854.80
CO: $158.25
Hero (BTN): $803.40
SB: $468.20
BB: $600

Pre-Flop: Q Q dealt to Hero (BTN)
3 folds, Hero raises to $21, SB calls $18, BB folds

Flop: ($48) 4 5 A (2 Players)
SB checks, Hero checks

Turn: ($48) 5 (2 Players)
SB bets $24, Hero calls $24

River: ($96) 3 (2 Players)
SB checks, Hero checks

Results: $96 Pot ($3 Rake)

Hero showed Q Q (two pair, Queens and Fives) and WON $93 (+$48 NET)
SB showed 7 9 (a pair of Fives) and LOST (-$45 NET)

Full Tilt Poker, $3/$6 NL Hold'em Cash Game, 6 Players

BTN: $167.50
SB: $846.70
BB: $171
Hero (UTG): $905.65
MP: $510.20
CO: $446

Pre-Flop: Q Q dealt to Hero (UTG)
Hero raises to $21, 3 folds, SB calls $18, BB folds

Flop: ($48) K A A (2 Players)
SB checks, Hero checks

Turn: ($48) 5 (2 Players)
SB bets $30, Hero calls $30

River: ($108) 6 (2 Players)
SB checks, Hero checks

Results: $108 Pot ($3 Rake)
SB showed J Q (a pair of Aces) and LOST (-$51 NET)
Hero showed Q Q (two pair, Aces and Queens) and WON $105 (+$54 NET)

Whenever I make a bet, I first like to identify its purpose. Value or bluff? In other words do I want him to call or fold? When I have a hand like mid pair on the flop, I typically expect to get called by TP the majority of the time. Im effectively folding out everything Im ahead of and paying off anything that Im behind. With a hand like mid pair, it is good idea to check it back if you dont think you can get value from worse hands. Each situation is independent though, bc I will sometimes bet mid pr for value on a draw heavy board.

Most of the value I get from it will be from bluffs. It is fairly standard in today's games to stab the turn after a flop check from the preflop aggressor. However, good players at 600nl and higher are often aware that your hand cannot stand much heat and will barrel the turn and river. If it happens once, let it be and fold the river. If the same opponent tries to double barrel me again after I check the flop, Ill look him up on the river the second time around. To play it safe, you could even check back TP against this particular opponent to see if he has the goods or not. If you show him that you are willing to balance your checking range on occasion, he should be reluctant to double barrel bluff you in the future. Even if you only do it once to him, it will stick out in his memory.

3. Full Tilt Poker, $3/$6 NL Hold'em Cash Game, 6 Players

BB: $1,245
UTG: $1,370
Hero (MP): $741
CO: $642
BTN: $220.25
SB: $612

Pre-Flop: K A dealt to Hero (MP)
UTG folds, Hero raises to $21, 3 folds, BB calls $15

Standard. Villain in BB is a donk who has been taking weird lines against me. I have shown down a bluff against him as well.

Flop: ($45) A K T (2 Players)
BB checks, Hero bets $36, BB raises to $72, Hero raises to $192, BB calls $120

The check min raise is strong. If I were min raised from a donk in position, I would be inclined to give it less credit. If he were in position, Id say a good portion of his range is comprised of draws. As played, the check min raise is usually indicative of a strong made hand.

Turn: ($429) 9 (2 Players)
BB checks, Hero bets $528 and is All-In, BB calls $528

If he has QJ, so be it. Regardless of what I bet, I dont think he is going away. I opt to just shove it in there. However, I made a mistake in this hand. My raise on the flop was too small. I need to be thinking ahead in the hand. I want to set myself up for an easy turn shove. I should have made my flop raise about $225 so I could shove the turn for roughly a pot sized bet.

River: ($1,485) Q (2 Players - 1 is All-In)

Results: $1,485 Pot ($3 Rake)
BB showed K T (two pair, Kings and Tens) and LOST (-$741 NET)
Hero showed K A (two pair, Aces and Kings) and WON $1,482 (+$741 NET)

Since he gave us fits earlier with his weird lines, Martin suggested that we chat own him. (Children under the age of 18 are advised to receive parental consent before reading any further.) His recommendation was along the lines of, "S*ck it, b*tch." Chat ownage is an integral part of a poker player's arsenal. However, Im not one to chat own a donkey bc they he is the one who is most apt to put money in our accounts. A simple "Thank you, sir" will usually suffice for donkey chat ownage. In any event, we all got a good laugh out of Martin's comment so thats the main reason I included it. Ill be responding to any comments or questions.

Hand 1: Feb 11th

2008-02-12T08:23:00.000-08:00

This week I, LuckySOB, played 2/4 on Absolute. It was quite a boring session to be honest, but here's a few mistakes and an easy read if you just think a little.

Hand 1:

Stack sizes:
Hero: $449
BTN: $473
SB: $154

Preflop: (5 players) Hero is CO with Ts 8c
UTG folds, Hero raises to $16, BTN and SB call, BB folds

Standard opening range for me in the CO when folded too. BTN is a LAG player and SB is a donkey.

Flop: 6d Kd 7h (3 players, $52)
SB checks, Hero checks, BTN bets $36, SB folds Hero folds.

As played this is an easy fold, but I don't like not leading here. I'm leading a FD, an OE staight draw, and a K here, so I have to mix in the GS I think. The BTN didn't 3 bet my CO open so is likely not on a strong K and the SB is nothing to worry about. Leading myself often takes this pot down and gives me the abblity to get paid in full when the GS hits.

Hand 2: Feb 11th

2008-02-12T07:56:00.000-08:00

This hand was played poorly.

Stack sizes:
Hero: $444
UTG: $540

Preflop: (6 players) Hero is BB with Td Th
UTG raises to $16, 4 folds, Hero calls.

UTG is a LAG 23/16 so I'm not 3 betting his UTG open and make a standard call here.

Flop: 6c 3h 3d (2 players, $34)
Hero checks, UTG bets $24, Hero raises to $52, UTG folds.

Fisrt mistake is my raise amount, I'm working on 2.5x c/r these spots with air and with hands. But I figured wrong and raised too small. Should have been $60. Second is the fact that I c/r at all. This villian is known to DB, so why raise? Well like I said, I'm doing this with air and with a hand.....BUT.....this is neither air nor the type of hand I should be doing it with. The types of hands I want to do this with are either hands like (air) 89s, KQs, JTs......hands that are easy to fold if he plays back......or hands like 3X, 33, 66, 63. The whole idea is to do this with big hands and without as to get paid off by the big hands. But here I'm only putting myself in a terrible spot if he reraises me or even calls and an over comes. The better play here is to c/c the flop and turn and evaluate on the river.

Hand 3 : Feb 11th

2008-02-12T07:30:00.000-08:00

Not the most interesting hand, but it's amazing how easy the villans hand is to read.

Stack sizes:
MP: $406
UTG: $183
Hero BB: $437

Preflop: (6 players) Hero is BB with Ac Ks
Utg Calls $4, MP raises to $16, 3 fold, Hero raises to $52, UTG folds, MP calls.

The UTG player is terrible and I really don't expect him to come along with a raise/reraise behind his limp. The MP is a 23/10 that I don't have too much history with and this is a standard 3 bet for me vs 99% of these situations.

Flop: 9h 8h 2c ($110, 2 players)
Hero checks, MP checks

This is a Terrible flop for me, I'm not getting any pairs to fold and probably shoved on by AK of hearts. So I elect to check/fold, but villian checks behind.

Turn: As ($110, 2 players)
Hero bets $72, MP raises to $144, Hero riases to $390 is all-in, MP calls $354 and is all-in.

This is what is so comically interesting about his hand range. A player like this is never checking behind a flopped set or a FD w/overs, AA would either 4 bet PF or bet the flop and any hand making 2 pair is not raising that early and calling a 3 bet. So that leaves us with only 1 of 3 hands he could have.........AK, AQ, or AJ (and almost certainly not 2 hearts). So this is an easy shove.

Hero shows Ac Ks, MP shows Ad Qc ($819 pot)
River: Qh

Ok so lets forget the results......... that lucky bastard asshole, see.......I've let it go. The real interesting thing to note on this hand is simply how easy some villians will make it to read their hand. With just a little simple thought we know we are WAY ahead and these are the hands that make poker easy.

Hand 1 : 4th Feb

2008-02-05T02:53:00.000-08:00

OK, so it was my turn to be sweat last night (Dodgy), and I was expecting it to go one of two ways. I've been running crazy hot - the best run of my poker career so far - and I thought I'd either tear it up and win a ton, or I'd start my downswing! Luckily for the sake of the sweat, it was the latter! I think this was good though as we got into more interesting and difficult spots (rather than me being on the right side of coolers all night). I played four tables of $5/10NL on Full Tilt.

Hand 1

This hand is interesting because it brings up a really good point about adjusting the size of your bets based on your opponents' stack sizes.

Stack sizes:
CO: $969
Hero: $2974

Pre-flop: (5 players) Hero is SB with Jh Jc
UTG folds, CO raises to $70, Button folds, Hero raises to $230, BB folds, CO calls.

I had some history here with the CO. I'd just 3-bet him recently and check-raised him all-in on the flop (to which he folded). I 3-bet him again, and I'm almost always felting this hand with his stack size.

Flop: Js Kd 3d ($480, 2 players)
Hero bets $320, CO folds.

The flop is superb for me and I bet $320 leaving him $419 left to raise me. This is definitely a mistake. Dice made the point that a bet of $230 ish would be much better as it allows him to raise me by 3x. I totally agree with this. My bet size was fine if he had a full stack, but I failed to adjust properly to this more unique situation.

Uncalled bets:
$320 returned to Hero.

Results:
Final pot: $480

Hand 2 : 4th Feb

2008-02-05T02:46:00.000-08:00

Hand 2

Stack sizes:
Hero: $1182
BB: $980

Pre-flop: (6 players) Hero is UTG+1 with 9d Td
UTG folds, Hero raises to $35, 3 folds, BB calls.

Here I'm UTG+1 and make a raise with T9s which is fine. I get called by the BB who is a good regular, a little looser pre-flop than most.

Flop: Ad Qd Js ($75, 2 players)
BB checks, Hero bets $55, BB calls.

The flop is pretty good for me giving me a flush draw and a straight draw. I'm not 100% sure what I would do if raised here, as I think AQ, AJ, and QJ would be big parts of his range. Therefore, I probably wouldn't have too much fold equity and might just have to call with my draw rather than shove.

Turn: Tc ($185, 2 players)
BB bets $150, Hero calls.

The turn puts four to a straight out and he leads into me. At this point it seems like he has a KQ/KJ type hand, or he could have a small flush draw and be trying to represent a K. I don't think I have enough fold equity to put in a raise here, so I make a call instead. I'm 4-1 to hit my flush, so I need to win $600 to make this a profitable call (4 x $150). With his bet the pot is $335, so I only need to win another $300ish off him on the river if I hit. If he has a K I think I'll definitely get paid, and if he doesn't have a K then I'll have more outs than just the flush cards.

River: Th ($485, 2 players)
BB checks, Hero checks.

The river gives me trips and he checks to me. I might have the best hand here but, given the range we gave him on the turn (KQ, KJ, low flush draws), there's no way I can value bet.

Results:
Final pot: $485

BB showed Kc Jc
Hero mucks 9d Td

Hand 3 : 4th Feb

2008-02-05T02:28:00.000-08:00

Hand 3

Stack sizes:
Hero: $1047
SB: $1496.25

Pre-flop: (5 players) Hero is CO with Kd Qc
UTG folds, Hero raises to $35, Button folds, SB raises to $125, BB folds, Hero calls.

The SB here is an aggressive regular and will definitely 3-bet a wide range. I opt to defend with KQ, which is pretty standard when I open from the cut-off.

Flop: As 3d 5s ($260, 2 players)
SB bets $220, Hero raises to $500, SB folds.

These types of flops are excellent flops to make a play at imo. Anything that comes Axx, Kxx, or even Qxx, isn't going to hit a guy with a wide 3-betting range that often. Also, I'm very likely to defend with AQ-AT. Note that my raise is only just over a min-raise (I actually do min-raise here sometimes). Furthermore, I raise to an amount where he can't bluff-shove me off a draw as I've 'committed' myself, so he either has to fold or risk going with a weak pair.

Uncalled bets:
$280 returned to Hero.

Results:
Final pot: $700

Hand 4 : 4th Feb

2008-02-05T02:14:00.000-08:00

Hand 4

I think this hand is interesting because there are so many different ways in which it can be played. It's also against the same opponent as hand 3.

Stack sizes:
Hero: $1369
BB: $1293.25

Pre-flop: (5 players) Hero is Button with 7c 9c
2 folds, Hero raises to $35, SB folds, BB raises to $120, Hero calls.

The BB is an aggressive regular who 3-bets fairly often. Here I decide to call with 97s and play a flop. I'm planning on using my position to take some pots away from him. Folding here is obviously fine. I would pretty much never 4-bet as my hand plays too well post-flop to turn it into a bluff, and I think calling with position is a much better option than getting involved in a pre-flop war.

Flop: 2s 3h 9d ($245, 2 players)
BB checks, Hero checks.

This is a good flop for me and he checks. Given the hand I'd just played against him (hand 3), I wasn't sure what he was going to do if I bet. I will definitely bet here sometimes, but I prefer to bet when I'm confident in knowing what to do to a check-raise. Here I wasn't, so I elected to check behind.

Turn: Jc ($245, 2 players)
BB bets $170, Hero calls.

The turn brings an overcard and he bets. This isn't necessarily bad for me. The way I look at it, he can have a maximum of two overcards to the board. Five different overcards can hit, and I believe he'll bet all of them. That means that I can call the turn and be correct at least 60% of the time. The downside is that the river will be a tough decision but, in the words of Dice, "That's why we get paid good money to do this job".

River: Tc ($585, 2 players)
BB checks, Hero checks.

The river gave me a horrible feeling when he checked. I said at the time that I really felt like turning my hand into a bluff, despite having showdown value. I decided not to as I do have showdown value and the only hands I can get to fold are Tx hands (and he might not even fold them). He can also have a J here and he'll never fold that. I really felt like he had showdown value when he checked though, and I think his showdown value will almost always be better than a pair of 9s.

Results:
Final pot: $585

BB showed Ah Td
Hero mucks 7c 9c

Low stakes time.

2008-01-23T16:05:00.000-08:00

Today I Noeledge grinded 3 tables of 200NL while the crew sweated. It was standard for the most part. Lets get to the action.

Hand 1: Villain is 32/24/3.6-453 sample

Absolute Poker No-Limit Hold'em, $2 BB (6 handed) Hand History converter, Courtesy of PokerZion.com
Button ($74.80)SB ($327.12)BB ($474.80)UTG ($185)Hero ($225.80)CO ($440.05)
Preflop: Hero is MP with Qh, Qc. 1 fold, Hero raises to $8, 3 folds, BB calls $6.

Flop: ($17) 6d, 8h, Kh (2 players)BB checks, Hero bets $12, BB raises to $40, Hero calls $28.
I had a sick feeling villain was going to check raise this board and almost checked. The crew felt it was a bet and I believe it was. Villain does what i felt would happen and calling is a must. Yes he could have better but this can be a draw as well or a move.

Turn: ($97) 2c (2 players)BB checks, Hero checks.
he checks we check as there is no reason to bet.

River: ($97) 8s (2 players)BB bets $194, Hero folds.
The river is interesting as villain sizes out an overbet shove. These are spots where I think those of us grinding 200NL and below might be tempted to make an amazing hero call, DONT! If he turns a busted FD into a huge bluff more power to him we will catch him soon enough. It is much more likely he holds a monster.

Final Pot: $291
Results below: BB doesn't show. Outcome: BB wins $291.

Hand 2

2008-01-23T15:00:00.000-08:00

Hand 2: Villain is 19/14/2.8-Large sample

Absolute Poker No-Limit Hold'em, $2 BB (5 handed) Hand History converter, Courtesy of PokerZion.com
Hero ($290.40)SB ($397)BB ($171.40)UTG ($148)MP ($554.90)
Preflop: Hero is Button with As, Ah. UTG calls $2, 1 fold, Hero raises to $10, SB calls $9, 1 fold, UTG calls $8.
Flop: ($32) 2h, 5s, 8c (3 players)SB checks, UTG bets $12, Hero raises to $32, SB raises to $101, UTG folds, Hero folds.

This is an awesome hand and shows a solid concept. When I get donked into by shorty I am never folding and will be glad to get it in. The great thing about his donk lead is it allows me to make a small raise and get info on where SB is at in the hand. Any action he takes besides folding is going to be alarming. He 3bets and at 1st I am tempted to jam, I might spew my stack here but the crew wouldnt allow me to, majority rules and I think we can clearly see this is a fold. His check 3 bet is so strong it isnt funny and a large part of his range, though very spewy, is small PP.

Final Pot: $177
Results below: No showdown. SB wins $177.

Hand 3

2008-01-23T14:00:00.000-08:00

Hand 3: Villain is 56/4/5.4- 84 hand sample

This hand appears very standard but may be a spot where some low limit grinders get owned.

Absolute Poker No-Limit Hold'em, $2 BB (5 handed) Hand History converter, Courtesy of PokerZion.com
Button ($151.62)SB ($559)BB ($106)Hero ($390.82)MP ($41.83)
Preflop: Hero is UTG with Qc, Qs. Hero raises to $8, 3 folds, BB calls $6.
Flop: ($17) Jh, Jd, 9h (2 players)BB checks, Hero bets $12, BB calls $12.
To check call the flop he can have a pretty wide range, Jx, 9x XXh and a combo of straight draws.

Turn: ($41) 6h (2 players)BB checks, Hero checks.

The turn completes a draw and he checks. Betting here is a sin, especially because of stack size. It is rare villain calls with worse on this turn and checking will get me value on the river from those hands. Also if villain check raises I have to fold everytime. betting is spew in our opinion.
River: ($41) 4c (2 players)BB bets $14, Hero calls $14.
River is an easy call. way to extract max value donk, LOL.

Final Pot: $69
Results below: BB has Jc 9s (full house, jacks full of nines). Hero has Qc Qs (two pair, queens and jacks). Outcome: BB wins $69.

Poker swings.

2008-01-17T13:28:00.000-08:00

Poker Swings

This article is going to focus on the types of “bad” swings we encounter throughout playing poker. The points I’m looking to focus on include:

What causes swings
How often do they happen
How big will they be
How can you stop them

What causes swings?

First let us look at what a swing is. Simply a run of consistently losing more than normal. A swing is not a run of bad luck always. It can be and is probably more often a run of bad play. In poker we play to maximize our winnings from positive expectation situations, meaning making plays that will win in the long run. The swings are what happen between now and the long run.

One common cause of a swing is mathematical. If a situation can happen, eventually it will. It is mathematically possible to lose with your AA vs KK twice in a row, so if you play enough, expect it at some point in time. This would be a down swing, yes a very short one, but still a down swing all the same. Now a situation like this can often cause a player to play worse than they normally would over a few hundred or even thousand hands and turn a 2 hand down swing into a large down swing.

The 2 graphs are a perfect example of this. The top graph is from a winning player that has great control of his game and plays close to his “A” game no matter how bad things get. It shows in his swings which are frequent but small. The bottom graph is from another winning player that admits to tilting a bit after a cooler or 2. And although a winning player, the swings are amplified to be much larger than bad luck or mathematics would cause them to be.

I believe the biggest part of swings to simply be a run of bad play, usually following a short run of bad outcomes in favorable situations. But there are a few other things that can cause bad swings, such as playing tired, drunk, poor game selection, or playing in a bad mood. You may say these aren’t swings, just bad times to play. But anything that causes a loss is part of what can cause a bad swing.

Yes it is possible to endure large swings when playing your 100% “A” game, but they are fewer than many wish to admit. Many things cause a bad swing, but it’s mostly the player that causes them to be so big.

How often do they happen?

Well this is not really something you can answer, because it’s never consistent. Part of controlling how often they happen is a large difference in the skill of a player. A top player can expect to see 5 buy in swings happen every 30,000 hands. While a good player can expect to see swings of the same size twice as often and many times much larger than just 5 buy ins.

Two large factors in the frequency of bad swings will be the style/aggression of your play along with your ability to control playing you “A” game.

Again, if we focus on the 2 graphs, we see that 2 top players encounter swings as different frequencies and different sizes. Although both show decent winnings, the one that controls swings obviously can win quite a bit more.

How big will they be?

Again, not an easy typical answer to this question. It’s another player dependent situation. I’m not an expert on knowing the situations everyone has been through, but I can comment based on my observations of many winning players graphs include the 2 shown here.

It seems quite common that players encounter swings on occasion of 10 buy ins along with often runs in the 5 buy in range. At any rate, our focus should not be on how large we can expect a downswing to be, but on how we can get out of it ASAP.

How can you stop them?

Well if you are a top notch emotion controlling grade A player as the player from the top chart is, you don’t have to do anything. Just keep playing and it will end. But for the remaining 99.9% of us, there’s more to it.

The best advice that can be given for getting out of a bad swing is simple, quit playing. That’s it. No don’t quit poker, just quit for the day. Get your mind off it and do something else. Preferably something you enjoy. Quit thinking poker, don’t study poker, don’t review your hands, don’t sweat someone, just quit for the day. All those things just mentioned you shouldn’t do are good things to do……..tomorrow.

If you refuse to quit for the day, or come back the next day to the same results, get help. Have someone watch you play. Many players play better when being watched, they fear making dumb plays and will focus more on their “A” game. This can come in the form of a coach, friend, spouse, or a CR member that likes to trade sweat sessions.

Be honest. Don’t tell yourself along with others that is all bad cards. Look through those hands and really pick yourself apart. You can’t improve your game if you are not honest about where it is. Don’t just look at the big hands either. Pay attention to the little ones. When a bit upset from a cooler, it’s possible to spew a lot of money over playing too many small pots and causing a large downswing of many many small pots.

If you just can’t seem to pull out of a swing, get a coach right away. I think any poker player that is serious about playing should be getting coaching at all times. But during a long down swing you should defiantly be paying someone to help you rather than paying your opponents off just to play you.

I hope this will help you understand bad swings. Obviously we focused more on tilting than swings, but really that’s all swings are. A way to say tilting without taking the blame. You can see from many top players graphs that swings happen to everyone. So next time you are on one yourself, come back and visit this article, remember you are not alone and focus on getting out of it.

Hand 1: 14th Jan

2008-01-14T19:15:00.000-08:00

This week was Dice14 playing four tables of $2/4NL on Full Tilt.

Hand 1

This hand caused quite a lot of discussion. We've annotated it with our thoughts as the hand played out, and we've added the thoughts after discussion underneath.

Stack sizes:
UTG: $1022
Hero: $458.90

Pre-flop: (6 players) Hero is Button with Qh Qd
UTG raises to $14, 2 folds, Hero raises to $48, 2 folds, UTG raises to $149, Hero calls.

This opponent is an aggressive regular. He made a pretty quick 4-bet from UTG to our BTN 3-bet. Here, we'd expect his UTG 4-betting range to be fairly strong as we'd expect him to assume our 3-betting range is strong. We elect to call looking for a non A/K flop.

Flop: 7d 6d 9c ($304, 2 players)
UTG bets $333, Hero folds.

The timing of his bet (insta), and the fact that our hand looks like QQ/JJ, led us to make a fold here. He can't expect us to be folding anything after we call pre-flop, so he's very likely to have QQ beat here.

Uncalled bets: $333 returned to UTG.

Results:
Final pot: $304

In hindsight, we think that a decision needs to be made pre-flop when he 4-bets. Either we're ahead of his range or we're behind, and we should shove or fold accordingly. The problem with calling a 4-bet is that you have such a tiny range for doing so. What would anyone call this 4-bet with other than AA-JJ? AK will shove pre-flop as it wants to see five cards. JJ may fold quite often, KK will probably shove more often than calling, so that leaves AA and QQ as out main range. Most people would probably just shove AA, that leaves ou range as something like QQ, AA, JJ, KK (in rough order of frequency).

Now, that is a strong range, but it allows our opponent to play well post-flop really. If he was 4-bet bluffing he can check-fold or bet if he hits hard. If he was 4-betting for value, he's able to make a decent decision post-flop. The only way to counter this small range is to make it wider. However, I don't think widening our 4-bet calling range is going to be particularly profitable. Therefore, never calling a 4-bet is probably the best way to go.

Hand 2: 14th Jan

2008-01-14T19:11:00.000-08:00

This week was Dice14 playing four tables of $2/4NL on Full Tilt.

Hand 2

Stack sizes:
UTG: $512.80
Hero: $418.30

Pre-flop: (4 players) Hero is BB with Jd Jc
UTG raises to $14, 2 folds, Hero raises to $48, UTG calls.

This opponent was a tight player and there would have been some merit to flat-calling with JJ pre-flop here. However, we think that raising is still the best play. It helps to define his hand when you raise, and it gives you the initiative on the flop. We estimated that a rough calling range for him would be any pair (as he does have implied odds), possibly AK/AQ, and occasionally some suited connectors (although these will be very rare).

Flop: Kd Kh 8c ($98, 2 players)
Hero bets $66, UTG calls.

This isn't a great flop against his range as we're probably not going to fold out any better hands. We might get a bit of value from some worse hands (TT/99), and we make a bet. His range for calling this flop is likely to be AA, KK, QQ, JJ, TT, 99, 88, AK. He could float with AQ, although this is unlikely. Again, he could have 98s or 87s, but this is very unlikely too.

Turn: 8h ($230, 2 players)
Hero checks, UTG checks.

We don't think there's much value in betting the turn here. We might force a fold from QQ, but that's not enough of a reason to bet. He checks behind, which we think he'll do with his entire range.

River: Ah ($230, 2 players)
Hero checks, UTG bets $175, Hero folds.

This is a weird river card because it doesn't look good, but it doesn't really affect the values or our hands. We check again and he makes a bet that looks like a value bet. Out of the range we've given him, he'd have to be turning TT/99 into a bluff here quite often to make this a profitable call. We don't think he'd do that very often, and there's a large portion of his range that would value bet this river (AA, AK, KK, 88).

Uncalled bets: $175 returned to UTG.
Results:
Final pot: $230

Hand 3: 14th Jan

2008-01-14T19:10:00.000-08:00

This week was Dice14 playing four tables of $2/4NL on Full Tilt.

Hand 3

Stack sizes:
UTG: $540.70
UTG+1: $660.80
Hero: $452.30
Button: $611.20
SB: $408.40
BB: $439

Pre-flop: (6 players) Hero is CO with 6c 6h
UTG calls, UTG+1 raises to $18, Hero calls, Button calls, 2 folds, UTG calls.

The raiser here was an aggressive regular and we'd been battling with him over a couple of tables. This is definitely a reasonable spot to go ahead and make a 3-bet, but the limper and the button were both loose players so there's more value here in calling and having them call along.

Flop: 5c 4c 7c ($78, 4 players)
UTG checks, UTG+1 checks, Hero bets $56, Button calls, 2 folds.

We hit a very interesting flop. We have possibly 6 straight outs, 2 straight flush outs, and we might have the best hand. It gets checked to us and we decide to bet. The rationale behind this bet is that it's virtually impossible for the pre-flop raiser to have a hand he's willing to continue with (as he would bet). He's also very unlikely to make any sort of play at us as it's a four-way pot and he'll be playing more straight forward. It's likely that one of the looser plays may call us, but we could have the best hand, and most certainly have decent equity.

Turn: 7s ($190, 2 players)
Hero bets $100, Button raises to $200, Hero folds.

Unfortunately it was the player behind us that called, so we have to play the turn out of position. We elect to make a "blocker" type bet, which gets fairly quickly min-raised. This is now a really awkward spot. We have to assume that the BTN has a made flush or a 7. He could also have a made full house. Even if he only has the bare Ac, the river is going to be really tough for us to play. Given all of this, we think a fold is probably best.

Another option on this turn would have been to check-call. This would work pretty well if we felt that our opponent wouldn't be betting the river as a bluff very often at all.

Uncalled bets: $100 returned to Button.
Results:
Final pot: $390

Hand 4: 14th Jan

2008-01-14T19:02:00.000-08:00

This week was Dice14 playing four tables of $2/4NL on Full Tilt.

Hand 4

Stack sizes:
SB: $458
Hero: $418.30

Pre-flop: (6 players) Hero is BB with 9d 7h
4 folds, SB raises to $16, Hero calls.

The SB here is a very aggressive regular, so we felt it would be fine to defend with a hand as weak as 97o here.

Flop: 9h 8d 2s ($32, 2 players)
SB bets $20, Hero calls.

This is a good flop for us. We make a very standard call.

Turn: 6h ($72, 2 players)
SB checks, Hero checks.

This is a really interesting spot on the turn. The standard line is to check behind this turn and then make a decision on the river (and this is the best line in general). However, we think this turn brings up a really interesting and unusual spot. This is a spot where it would have been a really cool play to bet the turn to induce a bluff raise from our aggressive opponent. If we bet this turn, it looks like we're floating (why would we bet a marginal hand on the turn?), and an aggressive opponent is definitely capable of making a play blind-on-blind. Obviously we're never folding if we bet the turn - it's for value.

River: Ah ($72, 2 players)
SB checks, Hero checks.

The river is a standard check behind. I think we would've called a bet as the ace is a really good card for him to represent if he has air.

Results:
Final pot: $72
SB showed 6c 5c
Hero showed 9d 7h

Hand 1 : 7th Jan

2008-01-08T02:33:00.000-08:00

Ok, so we had our first sweat session of the new year last night. LuckySOB, DODGYKEN, and peten2toms were present. Dice was spending some time with family before returning to school. LuckySOB was playing 2/3 tables of $2/4NL on Absolute. These were the interesting hands that came up, with our thoughts interspersed. All hands are on 6-max tables, we've just shortened them to save space. If you want to leave any feedback or questions about any of the hands, please feel free to do so in the comments. We'll be checking back regularly.

Hand 1

Stack sizes:
Hero: $494
SB: $1594.85
BB: $782.20

Pre-flop: (4 players) Hero is UTG with Jh Ah
Hero raises to $16, Button folds, SB calls, BB calls.

Flop: 5s 6c 4c ($48, 3 players)
SB checks, BB checks, Hero checks.

This is a terrible flop to make a continuation bet into two players on. We check and plan on giving up the hand to any action.

Turn: As ($48, 3 players)
SB checks, BB checks, Hero bets $36, SB calls, BB raises to $72, Hero calls, SB calls.

This is an awkward turn as it's necessary to bet to protect against all the draws versus two players. However, the ace is a card that the other two players will expect us to bet pretty often, so the fact that they've checked twice doesn't necessarily mean that they're weak here. We do make a bet (planning on probably checking behind on the river), and we get a min check-raise from the BB.

This is a spot where a fold is best. Even though we're getting super odds from the pot, the BB has made a really small check-raise on the turn into a three-way pot. It certainly doesn't look like he's trying to force us out.

River: 7h ($264, 3 players)SB checks, BB bets $60, Hero calls, SB folds.

He bets so small on the river that we're pretty much forced to call. However, the mistake we made here was on the turn. We were forced to pay off another 15BBs on the river due to our poor turn call.

Results:
Final pot: $384
BB Shows 7d 8h

Hand 2 : 7th Jan

2008-01-08T01:58:00.000-08:00

Hand 2

Stack sizes:
Hero: $511
SB: $277.40

Pre-flop: (5 players) Hero is Button with Ts Qd
UTG calls, CO folds, Hero raises to $16, SB calls, 2 folds.

A very standard button isolation when UTG limps in.

Flop: 8h 3d Qs ($40, 2 players)
SB bets $8, Hero raises to $24, SB calls.

We hit top pair and get donk led into for 1/5th of the pot. We elect to make a small raise. We discussed this afterwards and decided that it's probably best to just call here. SB's range for donking is probably wide, but something like Qx, 33, 88, any pair, JT, J9, T9, air. There's not a lot of value in raising here as it's essentially turning our hand into a bluff.

We decided that raising these donk leads is probably a better if you have nothing yourself (or bottom/second pair). When you have top pair, it's probably better to call and try to see a cheap showdown (unless your hand is so strong that you want to build the pot, or the board is drawy enough that you need to protect).

Turn: 3c ($88, 2 players)
SB checks, Hero checks.

Standard check for pot control.

River: Kh ($88, 2 players)
SB checks, Hero bets $56, SB folds.

We go for some thin value on the river and get a fold.

Hand 3 : 7th Jan

2008-01-08T01:56:00.000-08:00

Hand 3

Stack sizes:
UTG: $314.31
Hero: $512.70

Pre-flop: (5 players) Hero is BB with 9s 5h
UTG calls, CO (poster) checks, 2 folds, 2 folds, Hero (poster) checks.

Flop: 9c 8s 5c ($14, 3 players)
Hero bets $12, UTG calls, CO folds.

We hit top and bottom pair on a very draw-heavy board. These are spots that need to be played fast as our hand is very vulnerable.

Turn: Th ($38, 2 players)
Hero checks, UTG bets $20, Hero calls.

The turn makes the board scarier, and we check to UTG. After discussion, we agreed that betting is better here as we still probably have the best hand, and we need to continue to protect it. When you hit a poor two pair, it's important to normally keep betting to protect your hand.

River: Td ($78, 2 players)
Hero checks, UTG bets $24, Hero calls.

At this point, the odds we were getting to call were so great that a call seemed necessary. However, if we had bet the turn, we might not have had to call the river. This is a decent example of how errors on previous streets can compount to errors on later streets. This isn't a huge error, but you can see the point.

Results:
Final pot: $126
UTG Shows Jc Qc

The group resumes...

2008-01-03T03:22:00.000-08:00

We started this group back in July. A Cardrunners member called peterpjames had the idea of a group of low limit players starting blogs and forming a community that would help each other out. The idea was excellent, and it worked very well - there are still a lot of regular bloggers from the original core of us. Five of us decided to begin another group. We felt like we were perhaps the most serious and committed players at the time, and we felt that forming a "break-away" group would benefit our progression further. Our plan was to have a weekly group sweat session followed by a discussion, as well as simply being there for each other as we went along on our poker journey.

We started this site with the plan to track our progress, and to discuss topics and hands that we found interesting or important. Unfortunately, we fell back on updating the site and then left it alone altogether. Well, now we're in 2008, we plan on starting the site back up with regular updates. The original group began with five members: Alex (DWarrior), Jason (LuckySOB), Joe (Dice14), Martin (DODGYKEN), and Noel (peten2toms). Unfortunately, Alex has decided to stop playing poker for the foreseeable future so our group is now a foursome. We wish Alex all the best with his studies, and hope he returns to poker at some point.

The plan for the blog in the immediate future is to write up the interesting hands that come out of our weekly sweat session. We'll be writing up the discussion that takes place after the sweat on the most interesting hands, and it'll be posted on here. We'll also be updating our own stories at the bottom right of the page. Each of us will have a link, and you can click on that link to read about where we've come from, and where we're at now. Along with this, there will be other things put up on the site regularly, and we'll all continue to update our personal blogs.

All the best for 2008,

Jason, Joe, Martin, and Noel.

Group to resume soon.

2007-12-10T07:12:00.000-08:00

We've been slaking in content here and we apologize. DWarrior has decided to exit the group for now to be able to commit to school, and we will miss him. We are considering another member, but nothing is sure yet. Please look for new content to come following the new year.

Making Good Decisions.

2007-10-16T16:31:00.000-07:00

My favorite poker story is a story I read somewhere, but I don’t remember where or who. I believe it was a top pro and a beginning player sitting together at a tourney where this came up. Something in the back of my mind makes me think the pro was Jonny Chan……….anyway……

Beginning Player: “How do you consistently win at poker?”
Top Pro: “Making good decisions”
BP: “How do you know which are good decisions”
TP: “Experience”
BP: “How do you get proper experience”
TP “Making bad decisions”

Funny, simple, but so true. We don’t win by making bad decisions, we don’t win by making robotic decisions, (Phil Laak and Anontio both beat a computer programmed to play perfect Holdem), we don’t win by guessing. We win by making good decisions.

Poker is a game of math that will see the player with the mathematical edge win in the long run. But there are also a few things non-mathematical that come into play, and these things all must go into our decision making process. I’m not going to tell you that playing strictly by math will not allow you to win, or that listening to your instincts will be better than worrying about +/-EV. I am going to say that you win by making “Good Decisions”.

Example: Everyone has 100 BB at the table. You hold AK of hearts, it’s folded to the CO who pot raises, you 3 bet it pot from the BTN, the blinds fold and the CO calls. Flop is 2h 3h 8d, CO checks you bet 2/3 pot and CO shoves…….what do you do? If you said fold, that’s a bad decisions. If you said call, that’s a bad decision. Okay that was a set up. Of course you should call, even if your opponent only plays AA or KK that way, you still are a 42% favorite in this hand, and if you add in JJ and QQ to his range you are 50/50. So the correct decision would be………Call “because” of pot odds. Make sense? A correct decision is not a good decision unless you know why it’s the correct decision. If you make the correct play but don’t know why, then that’s just luck. Not luck that you win the hand when you do, but luck that you made the correct play.

The point I’m stressing here, is that every decision you make at the poker table should have a reason to back it up. Many times it’s simple, “Call an all in because I have the nuts”…….that’s always fun, or “Fold to a tight player when I have air and no draws”……seems simple. What about the times when it’s not so simple, or as we call them……..the tough spots. Regardless of what decision you make, do you have a why when you make it, or do you have a hope? Is it likely that your opponent would bet a missed flush draw, or do you hope he bet a missed flush draw when you get ready to call with that mid pocket pair.

Try this exercise. Open just 2 tables of your normal game, and talk through every hand as if you were explaining the game to someone that is new. Explain out loud every thought you have that went into deciding what to do every time you act. Don’t be afraid to be wrong, no one is actually there. Then go back afterwards and run the hands in the replayer. Check the odds vs your why and see if you were correct. Check the opponents cards vs the range you had them on and see if you were correct. Adjust your “why” until you are correct more………then you will win more.

I’m not writing this because I think this is an area of my game that I excel in and want to teach. I’m writing this because this is an area I’m terrible at and want to improve on. I feel I can review a hand well when not playing, but I need to learn to make my why decisions during a hand. I think I make a lot of correct decisions, now I’m looking to make good ones.

LuckySOB

Sept Goals Review

2007-10-06T11:19:00.000-07:00

Every month, each of us will post a quick review of our goals from the previous month. I think this group helped improve our games a lot, but we're still working out ways to study as agroup more effectively.

DODGYKEN: I did manage to sustain 4BB/100 but over only 30k hands of $200NL instead of 40k. I was happy with this though and I'll be playing a mix of $400NL and $200NL in October. My work on hand ranges has really come on well I think, and it's making playing hands easier as I keep getting better at it. It's also helped to make the transition from $200NL to $400NL smoother than the last time I moved up limits.

DWarrior: September was a huge disappointment. I played only 20k hands, didn't do nearly the amount of studying I wanted, and ended up -1bb/100 for the month after losing 7 buyins over the last 2 days. I have to move back down to 50nl as a result and pick up.

Noeledge: September is behind me but I learned a valuable lessonand had a rough time of it at the tables. I could hidethe results and make like it never happened but then Iwould not be able to learn and grow. There is a sayingI have heard before about failures and it goessomething like, "there is no such thing but rathereach failure is only a failure if you fail to learnfrom it." With that said I have been doing someserious thinking and feel I have learned from thispast month and will be taking October on with a freshattitude and state of mind.Even though it appears I got my ass kicked and lost ashit load of money in reality I actually did profitfrom poker in Sept with live play and rakeback andreload as well as coaching. Not as much as I wouldprefer but everything doesnt always go the way youwant it to.

LuckySOB: September review was way off. I played half the hands I wanted butplayed much more 400nl than I was planning on. I jumped in and didbetter than I expected after having so many rough starts when movingup to 200nl. I didn't post as many hands as I had hoped too, but didspend the amount of time reviewing my and others hands that I hadplanned, and watched at least 2 vids every week. I'm not happy withmy month as far as meeting goals I set, but very happy with themonetary results I had and transition into 400nl.

Dice: September Recap: September did not exactly go as planned. In my tenureat 100nl,I have not had much success. Ive been on a break-even stretch the last 35khands. Results aside, I feel I am growing very quickly as a player. I have agreat support system and I am very appreciative of it. This game can be quitebrutal at times.

Heater

2007-09-20T01:06:00.000-07:00

I logged 1.5k hands tonight and won 7.5 BI. This is my biggest night to date. I was fortunate enough to have several donkeys to my immediate right on couple tables. I took a 250 bb stack off of this one donk to my right bc he would lead into every single turn and river so I simply started calling his bets down and often bluffed raised him on the river. Easy counter to someone who value bets excessively. I saw him do it with air several times and began to exploit it. He never seemed to catch on. I eventually caught a big hand when I stacked him with my straight over his top pair. UF2B had a productive group sweat tonight. We had some interesting discussion during the PT review. We were also informed by Noel that he has a poster of Mark Seif on his wall. LuckySOB drew a beautiful landscape of Noel's bedroom here on his blog. Tomorrow, Verneer will be working with Malfaire and I. Tomorrow night is my night to play, so I am looking forward to that.

August Goals Review

2007-09-16T21:11:00.000-07:00

Every month, each of us will post a quick review of our goals from the previous month. I think this group helped improve our games a lot, but we're still working out ways to study as agroup more effectively.

LuckySOB: I think I neglected my goals this month. I did play more 200NL than I ever had, (over 30K hands), and I did win. The sad thing is, I also put in about 15K hands of 100NL and lost. With rakeback, bonuses, and my 200NL winnings exceeding my 100NL loss plus some 400NL winnings, (followed a few 200NL donks up and beat them), I was able to have +3500 month in BR putting me just over 9K. But I only took 1 day off, and didn't learn one new thing everyday.

Noeledge: 25-30hrs poker per week, I failed miserably at this with my biggest week in hours consisting of 18.5hrs. Trust in my reads, I feel this will be a never ending battle as we play the game of poker. This month I have become comfortable going with what I perceive to be villains range and playing accordingly. I feel I improved in this area. Advance my analysis of villains range(take notes on all villains), I slacked off on the notes but my hand range analysis is improving. Give UF2B everything I got and then some; In this area I know I was a major slacker. We all have lives and sometimes it is hard to make time for the crew. I think as the months come and go we will begin to get a good feel of the workings and dynamics of the crew. Until then I imagine it will be slow going. Write one theory piece a week, Try one a month. This is something I definitely will be improving on and have already wrote a piece this month on my new poker blog.

Dice: I did not accomplish my goals for August. This month I will have much more time to devote to poker.

DWarrior: I think overall this month was one of the best for me, both money- and improvement-wise. I managed to successfully move up to 100nl ahead of schedule, and changed my approach to the game. Unfortunately, I didn’t provide enough value to UF2B, and didn’t put enough hours at the tables.

DODGYKEN:I hit 40k hands fairly easily. I am now a winner at the $200s, although not at my desired winrate yet. I'm constantly working on ranges, and this is a target for September too.

Note: these have been sitting in my inbox for 2 weeks, but I kept forgetting to turn them into a post. Just pretend they were posted at the beginning of September. - DWarrior

Game selection. We all hear it, but do we use it?

2007-09-12T18:02:00.000-07:00

We’ve all heard them……..”If you can’t spot the sucker at the table, then it’s you”………”you can be the 10th best player in the world, but that don’t help if you’re playing the top 9”………. Yet so many players don’t practice this enough or at all.

Many times I’ve read threads that discuss taking shots at the next level, and there’s always a comment about “playing your standard game and good game selection”. Shouldn’t that go without saying? Good game selection should have nothing to do with taking shots at higher stakes. It should be how we choose tables every time we play any game regardless of stakes.

I’ve played live poker for a long time, and I feel my game selection has been a great part of my success. I will give a few quick pointers that I like to use, and then get into online selection methods.

Without knowing any of the players in a live game, I will just walk up to the floor person and find out which tables are spreading the game I want. Get on the list right away, and then watch each table for a few minutes. The first thing I look for is big chip stacks. Are the big stacks smiling upbeat players, or slouched over grumps. I want to be at a table where the big stacks are smiling and talking and having fun. This more often indicates someone just there to play and getting lucky a bit……….easier to get those chips and a fun table is usually a loose table. The slouched grump that is not talking and watching every move everyone makes…….don’t expect to get his chips easy (hell, it might be me). And then the obvious, look for a table that has a more players seeing the flop. Once you get a seat, make it clear to the floor you want moved to table X asap.

When playing online, I’m looking for the same thing, but in a different way. Every site is different, but I’m going to use Full Tilt for my example here. FTP allows you to open 16 tables at one time, I use a datamining program, but you could do this manually also. Open 16 tables by selecting the ones with the highest % players see flop and pot size stats. Start up PT and import hands on them for a while. I usually do this for an hour, but even 10 mins can help a lot. The first thing I do is close all tables that are full of TAGS and open a few different ones.

Then I start viewing each table one by one. I’m looking first for players that I’ve marked as major donks. I use a specific color for players that singlehandedly make a table worth sitting at. Getting on the table is goal one, then changing position hopefully can be worked on later if you start out too close to the right of the donk. Sometimes when I get seated just to the right of the marked player and there’s one behind me in the wait list. I’ll get up and rejoin the list, but this has backfired and I never got a seat before he was busted. So I only do this when it’s a known player that likes to raise a lot of c bets and pushes too much.

Next I look for tables with deep stacks , this is the same concept as my live game selection. I’m looking for deep stacks that are not known regs or playing standard TAG. I love deep stacks in front of players with stats around the 40/12 range. These guys seem to be willing to pay too much for draws often. If I come across a table that has all other players right around 100BB, I’m passing. Yet I’m not too excited to see a table with a lot of short stacks either. I like find a mixture of stacks, but I would prefer more deep stacks than short ones.

Another thing I like to do is, every time a donk goes bust, I wait about 1 or 2 minutes and run a player search on him. I gladly will follow him all night long. Many times they will just sign off and have probably lost all monies on their account. But every now and then you will find them starting over on a different table, and you will have an advantage over the rest of the table in knowing what kind of player they are and the fact that they are probably still tilting. A few times I’ve even found them moving up in limits to recoup their loss quicker. I gladly sit in that game also if it’s just one jump up in stakes. Along those same lines, I will do a player search on all players I’m sitting with that I think I have a large edge over. Even donks are multi-tabling every now and then.

Once you’ve gotten a few good tables going. Always keep a few more open and review them in the same fashion to see if a better seat than the one you’re in becomes available. I’m very quick to jump off a table as soon as the lone fish leaves, and it’s nice to have a table ready and waiting.

Another thing to consider is moving down a level or even 2. This may not apply much until you get into upper mid stakes, but if you can’t find any good games, then search the next level down. Better to win at 400NL than to break even at 600NL. Don’t categorize yourself as a player of one specific level, be willing to move when the games are better.

One last thing I like to consider in my game selection is site selection. Those of you not in the US have a better ability for this than those of us that live in “The Land of the Free?”. I’ve found that certain sites are easier than others based on certain times of the day. And that’s based only on 3 sites I play at, so I’m sure it’s even better with the endless supply of rooms you “None Free” people can play in. I’m not going to give out all my info for which site is better at what times, partly because it seems to change a lot. For example, 2 months ago, the games on AP were so soft, that you could sign on…….take a nap and wake up with more money in your account than you started with. Now they are getting just as tough as many of the larger sites, (partly in thanks to an article in a major poker magazine stating how soft AP was). And I’m sure it’s also different for each level. But this is something you should be keeping an eye on and adjust your play accordingly.

All the great moves, styles, and methods of play you use only work better and pay you off more when you use good game selection. None of this should be new information to you, but I hope it motivates you to use it more and maybe will give you some guidelines to start out by.

LuckySOB

Why do we win at poker?

2007-09-07T05:04:00.000-07:00

What makes us winners at poker? Well, myself and Noel have been talking about this and

we've come up with a few reasons. One of the things that Noel has said is that a lot of the big pots we win/lose are when one big hand runs into another big hand. Surely these even out though and are pretty much neutral EV? Well, I agree that a lot of these situations are neutral EV. I think that the majority of our profits actually comes from other areas of our play.

I know that when I'm running well I rarely lose medium-big pots. I'll lose 100BB sometimes - normally when I make a bad read, run a big hand into a bigger one, or get unlucky - but the other pots I lose are rarely more than 25BBs. I just do not lose many medium sized pots. I think this is a major reason that we are consistent winners. I haven't asked the other guys in UF2B, but I suspect that their databases will show similar findings.

I've been reading Professional No Limit Holdem recently (which I recommend everybody purchases), and one of the ideas mentioned is that of deciding whether you are committed or not at various points throughout the hand. If you decide that you are not committed, they suggest that you shouldn't be putting more than 30% of your stack into the middle. This is an idea that I feel I've been using myself - albeit without the formailty of having it in writing. I tend to throw away a lot of one pair hands to resistance when I know that I'm not willing to call another bet or bets.

Another reason that we succeed is because we play consistently well. I know for a fact that I'm nowhere near one of the best players around, and I'm probably not even one of the best at my limit. However, I feel pretty confident in saying that I bet I'm one of the most consistent. I play to a very consistent level of play day in, day out. Part of this is due to the fact that I'm very emotionally stable, another part is due to the fact that I don't play drunk/tired/upset/frustrated/etc. The best player in the world might be able to hit 10BB/100 over 20k hands. If he also hits 0BB/100 over another 20k hands he still only makes 5BB/100 over those 40k hands.

A further reason is that I play a ton of hands at each level. I was saying to Noel that I feel ready to take a shot at the $400s on Friday and Saturday nights when there's some really good games running. I also have the bankroll to do it. There's no way I will though because I'm extremely disciplined and wish to prove myself to be a solid winner at the $200s before I try. It's the same with Noel - he's easily good enough to be playing the $200s right now, but he's chosen to prove himself at the $100s over a large sample of hands. I think this benefits us for when we move up in terms of having confidence that we can beat the level below, as well as acquiring a lot more poker knowledge at an easier level which will, in turn, make the step up easier.

Lastly, I think a major factor that separates solid winners from others is the amount of study they do. In my opinion, studying and analysing the game is more important than actually playing. Every single player who plays is going to be getting better at poker - even the fish. If you don't work hard to get better yourself, they will catch up to you, or even overtake you. Keep working hard on your game, analyse your hands, post on forums, read books and articles, watch Cardrunners videos (and watch them actively), and you'll stay one step ahead of the rest.

There are plenty of other reasons that we win and some others don't. The most obvious one, and this is what I lived by when I played limit, is that we make more with our winning hands, and lose less with our losing hands.

Maximise your profits, minimise your losses.

- DODGYKEN

We have not vanished.

2007-08-25T09:06:00.000-07:00

We are sorry for the lack of material in the last few weeks. We have members moving and starting back to school, so please be patient as we have more writings in the works. We are doing our weekly sweats and discusions, and will share soon more thoughts with everyone.

UF2B crew

C-Bet Post

2007-08-20T05:14:00.000-07:00

Your standard c-bet on a perfect flop: http://www.pokerhand.org/?1384359

This is why position is key. I raise a marginal holding in position
against a player who decided to post. This is a solid flop to cbet
against a SB call. I c-bet 70% pot. http://www.pokerhand.org/?1384402

This is a marginal spot. Most times this board doesnt connect with the
range villians put me on and against two opponents connects with
theirs. I think betting here is -EV. http://www.pokerhand.org/?1384415

The in between. One might argue a c-bet is profitable in this spot as
this is a semi-dry flop, yet I opt to take the free card. The problem
with c-betting this spot is both vilians are super loose and at the
time my cbetting wasnt working. If I connect on the turn wether with a
pair or my gutshot I would probably continue to the river in this
hand. http://www.pokerhand.org/?1384431

C-Bet Analysis

2007-08-19T17:47:00.000-07:00

http://www.pokerhand.org/?1384635
Villain is 70/1/.2 over 82 hands and is folding to c-bets 30% of the time.
Drawing to a gutshot vs. a loose passive villain makes this a perfect
spot to check behind for a free shot at the nuts. When the A pairs on
the turn, it makes for a perfect double barrel because a level one
thinker will be hard pressed to call without an Ace.

http://www.pokerhand.org/?1384664
Villain is 24/11/.7 over 73 hands. Paired boards make for good c-
betting flop texture. Against a passive opponent such as this one, he
will often call to peel off a turn card with 33-TT (assuming he 3-bets
JJ+). In the case that he calls the flop bet, I would follow up with a
strong turn bet here as he would be hard pressed to call a large turn
bet without a K and he must also be fearful of a large river bet.

http://www.pokerhand.org/?1384707
Villain is 52/3/.2 over 47 hands. The flop texture in conjunction with
this villain's calling range justifies a check behind. The turn bet is
a bluff which attempts to fold out most of the junk he cold calls with
preflop. As a pure bluff, my hand is very easy to get away from if I
experience any resistance.

-Dice

A few C-betting situations

2007-08-16T21:21:00.001-07:00

This board is a good place to cbet when in position. An ideal flop would replace the J with an 8, but it still works quite well. I do make my cbet here a bit smaller than normal due to the fact that this villian has shown he will call a raise with Ax or Kx from the blind, then c/c any pair. Yet he folds to most cbets.
http://www.pokerhand.org/?1379614

I just came off of losing a big hand prior to this, and made a bad cbet OOP possibly steaming a little. Just have to make sure to let go in spots like this as I did.
http://www.pokerhand.org/?1379623

It should be quite obvious that this is a spot to not cbet. (probably not even a good spot for a PFR)
http://www.pokerhand.org/?1379627

This is a spot that I don't cbet due to the villian. He plays a 45/10 game and folds less than 30% to cbets. I'm ready to just give up here. Remember that all good or bad moves can be the opposite with a different type of opponent.
http://www.pokerhand.org/?1379633

LuckySOB

Topic 1: Continuation Betting

2007-08-16T13:28:00.000-07:00

The profitability of every c-betting situation can be estimated by three steps:

Determining how much to bet
Calculating the required fold % of your opponents
Figuring out if they will fold often enough

Step 1
Determining how much to bet is fairly easy. Betting about 2/3 to 3/4 of the pot is optimal in most situations as it the near-perfect bet size where the bet is large enough to make opponents respect it, yet small enough not to chase away medium-strength hands. It is also a fairly standard bet size in today’s games, whereas pot sized bets usually get noticed and 1/2 pot bets tend to get called much lighter. Anything under 1/2 pot can get “spite called” or called extremely light because of the great odds (1/2 pot bet is laying 3:1 to the opponent, smaller bets give even greater odds). As a guideline, bet closer to 1/2 when there are more players in, as the monetary size of the bet will gain respect.

Step 2
Calculating the required fold % of your opponents is the easiest step, as it will be fully done in this article. When you make a bet that you don’t want called, you’re essentially saying “I bet this much that you will all fold,” and you would ideally like to know what odds you’re laying yourself. For example, 3/4 pot bet needs to win 43% of the time to break even; if they fold any more, you will show an immediate profit. If you’re facing two opponents, both of them must fold enough times so that, combined, they will be folding at least 43% of the time.

To save you the headache of having to calculate all these percentages on your own, here is a table of most common bet sizes and how often each villain must fold, on average, to break even:

* Note: this slightly underestimates opponent fold percentages, so you would like these numbers to be even higher.

For example, if you bet 2/3 of the pot facing 3 opponents, each opponent must fold more than 74% of the time, on average, for your bet to show an immediate profit. However, if one opponent is looser than the required minimum, the others must be tighter to make up for this. Continuing with the example, if one of your opponents only folds 60% of the time, the other two opponents must each fold more than 82% of the time. 82% is a pretty unreasonable expectation (this will be explained later), so you would conclude that the bet is not profitable.

You don’t have to memorize the table, but come back to it after you read the whole article and you will see which situations will rarely be profitable, which ones are marginal, and which ones will usually show a profit.

Step 3
Figuring out if they’ll fold often enough is the most difficult part. This is where real poker begins, and this is what the article is focused on.

According to computer simulations, a random hand hits a pair on the flop about 35% of the time. The obvious problems with this number is that villains are not seeing flops with all random hands, they will not continue with all pairs, they may continue with air, and they also flop draws. However, without a better estimate, 35% seems like a reasonable assumption as it looks like all those factors will roughly even out. So, with no other info on the opponent, you can assume that the baseline fold percentage is 65%. That is, on average an unknown villain will fold about 65% of the time to a normal sized bet (usually 3/4 pot). They may fold less often on some particular flops, but that will be explored later.

A better estimator of folding is PAHUD’s “Fold to Flop C-Bet”. You should be aware, however, that it may be skewed by low sample size. You should also consider the player’s VP$IP/PFR stats to see what style he’s playing. Unimaginative TAGs will usually be folding to c-bets 70%+ of the time. Nitty players will be 80%. Tricky TAGs may go in the low-mid 60s. Loose/bad players can either be fit-or-fold or gambly, so you need to check the Fold to Flop C-Bet to gauge how they’re playing. Some bad players will still be folding 70+% of the time, but others may be folding 30-50% on average.

These stats are averages, and are not can be higher or lower depending on specific situations. You should use them strictly as baselines and adjust that based on the situation.

The Board
The biggest factor, especially at lower stakes, is the board. Since most players are primarily concerned with their own holdings, the flop will influence how they will act on the hand.

First, the board should influence your bet size. If a cheaper bet will accomplish the same thing as a larger bet, then you should obviously take the cheaper bet and increase your odds. Keep in mind your table image, you don’t want to bet noticeably less when you miss and noticeably bigger when you hit.

The best example of how the board influences your action is in a multi-way pot. In a 4-handed or more pot, most opponents will be playing fit or fold, so a 1/2 pot bet will usually get called just as often as a 3/4 pot bet. When you’re holding a made hand, you also don’t need to bet bigger as 1/2 pot bet will usually be enough to let you get your stack in by showdown should you choose to, and at the same time keep the pot under some control with a marginal hand, so you can make your bluffs and value bets on the flop around 1/2 pot.

Another profitable example is Ace-high dry flops. You should be c-betting less in these situations for two reasons. One, your opponent(s) will more inclined to throw away weaker pairs than TP because the Ace is such a common holding card. Two, Ace is also a common holding card of your opponent, so you need to better your odds by betting less. Also, you shouldn’t be stabbing at Ace-high flops multi-way very often for the latter reason.

One potential pitfall is the advice that you should bet more on draw heavy boards. Most players will not fold draws on the flop regardless of your bet size, so all you’re doing is lowering your odds without affecting their calling ranges. It’s probably best to c-bet the same amount, and if you feel a flush draw or a straight draw is a big part of their range, take another stab on the turn (ideally a card that scares them). This way, you at least have a good chance of getting them to fold.

You also need to consider your opponent’s estimated range and determine how likely it is to have hit him. If the board is more likely than average to have hit your opponent, you decrease his fold %, if it’s less likely to have hit him, you increase it.

Here are some general pointers:
Obviously, the more dry the board, the less likely it is to hit your opponents. Good dry boards are usually 1 high card, 1 mid card, and 1 low card with not flush draw (ex: Kd 8s 2h). Paired boards are also usually dry (ex: Td Th 6s). Wet boards tend to be middle cards with a flush draw (ex: 9h 8h 6s) and are more likely to hit your opponents. 3-flush boards are actually better than 2-flush boards because people will be reluctant to play marginal hands and chase 1-card flush draws without a face card (ex: Th 8h 5h).

TAG callers are usually playing pairs and drawing hands, and they rarely call pre-flop raises with dominated high cards like KTo or Q9o. Therefore, high card dry flops are likely to intimidate them and at the same time not hit them. For example, AK7 rainbow shouldn’t get called very often by good TAGs. Middle card flops, on the other hand, connect perfectly with a TAG’s range, especially if there is a flush draw out as well, so 679 is a horrible flop to c-bet. Low cards and paired boards are unlikely to have hit them, though they may take a card off with Pocket Pairs. However, these boards are also unlikely to have hit you, so this is where observant TAGs will be making their moves. These boards are the most profitable c-bet spots vs unimaginative TAGs/nits, but this is where you have to be on the lookout vs decent players.

Loose/bad players often call with dominated hands, so high card flops do hit their ranges well, especially since unpaired hole cards come up so much more often on average than PPs and SCs. These boards may actually be the worst ones to c-bet against loose/bad players. Mid boards are still bad because PPs and SCs are still a good part of their range, and they may also call one bet with overcards. Low and paired boards are probably the best because you shouldn’t be expecting to get bluffed by these guys.

LAG players are probably the worst ones to c-bet. A ton of flops hit them, and they’re liable to play back at any point. You basically have to play poker against these guys and look for spots to re-steal, double barrel, and otherwise try to gain back some of your equity. Don’t get out of line though, as these guys face this regularly, so you’re playing on their turf.

Player Actions
Checks in front are more likely to be missed hands, so you’d obviously like to see all your opponents act before you to get the most info. For some players, leads into pre-flop raisers signify marginal hands trying to see where they’re at, so sometimes you can profitably raise these donk leads and take the money they give you.

Stack Sizes
Stay away from short-stacks. Many will go with any pair and less. Since most TAGs tend to c-bet too much, some shorties adopted a strategy of raising and check/raising c-bets very light. However, some are scared money, but it’s difficult to establish which is which until you see the guy shove garbage.

Your Image
If you have a bad table image, the players respect your c-bets less and so their average fold to c-bet naturally drops. Conversely, if you have a good image, they will stay away. This affects different players differently. Multi-tablers probably aren’t noticing your table image as much as your stats, though if you happen to put pressure on them across several tables, they may take a stand at any table.

Table image adds a whole another dimension to poker and cannot possibly be covered in this article.

Some Interpretations
If you look at the chart, even a pot-sized bet needs to only succeed 50% heads-up to be break-even. Combine that with the baseline of 65% fold % of an unknown player and you see that c-betting HU is obviously successful in most situations. Basically, you should be c-betting almost all but the worst flops. A c-bet should be standard here unless you find enough reasons otherwise. One reason could be for your table image, especially if you’ve been c-betting this player a lot.

A c-bet into 4 opponents, however, needs the average player to fold 77% of the time even with a 1/2 pot sized bet to be break-even. You can clearly see that this will require a much better than average situation vs unknown players. In this situation your standard play should be to give up the pot, unless you find enough reasons otherwise. This situation will usually be the standard “stab”, where everyone checks and you’re last or near-last to act, and the board is dry. You shouldn’t be expecting players to play back without the goods. Honestly, if you never c-bet without the goods here, you’re not passing that much profit at all, but it is very easy to c-bet too much in this spot and actually lose money. Whereas HU you don’t c-bet to add deception, here you’re c-betting to add deception, so your turn range after a bet is not always a made hand.

You can see that c-betting into 3 opponents isn’t a whole lot better. You should be doing it more often than into 4, but again you’ll need to find reasons to c-bet.

The real gray area is facing two opponents. This is where experience and the understanding of the above factors will get you to make near-optimal decisions.

More Info

DODGYKEN recorded a nice video on c-betting, click here to download it.
C-Bet Examples:

DODGYKEN

LuckySOB

C-betting examples

2007-08-14T04:55:00.000-07:00

Ok, I'm going to list some examples of hands where I have/haven't made a continuation bet, and the reasons/thoughts behind my actions.

This is a great flop to C-bet as the opponent has to have an A or a flush draw to carry on. Against one opponent, I'm C-betting this flop regardless of what I have.
http://www.pokerhand.org/?1368662

I think I made a mistake in C-betting this flop. The opponent is TAG/nitty and his range is much more likely to have hit this flop than mine (and he knows it). I should take a free card here and play from the turn.
http://www.pokerhand.org/?1368661

Here, this player was very loose pre- and post-flop, and had been calling pretty much all of my C-bets. Therefore I elected to not C-bet here even though the flop is a decent one to C-bet on. Against opponents who fold to C-bets 70% or more, I bet this flop.
http://www.pokerhand.org/?1368656

Lastly, this is good spot to double barrel as the opponent is likely to call with a low pair or 87 type hand on the flop. The K definitely helps my range (and I pick up the nut flush draw too).
http://www.pokerhand.org/?1368671

; DODGYKEN

Topic 1: Continuation Betting and Floating

2007-08-05T09:45:00.000-07:00

Warning- If you are a 1st level thinker please stay that way and avoid reading this material!

Some C-Bet Math
(tl;dr warning)
by DWarrior

I’m pretty sure everyone knows that continuation betting is betting the flop after raising pre. I think most TAGs c-bet way too much, as I routinely see 17/14 and the like with c-bet stats of 85-95%. I think this is very exploitable by the observant players and good hud-bots. I’ve worked my c-bet percentage down to 70%, which I’m told is a good number, and I’m constantly assessing flop situations to see where NOT to c-bet, as my default is still to bet out. I think the other UF2Bers have written good ideas on the subject, and instead of repeating them, I will try and explore c-betting using math.

First, the way I calculated my c-bet % is by going to PT’s General Info tab, hit More Detail button on the right, scroll down to the “First Action on Flop After a Pre-flop Raise:” list. You’ll see the different actions. Look for Bet and Check. The format is:
Bet: 58.94 % (323 times out of 548)
Check: 25.73 % (141 times out of 548)
You should only be concerned with the number of times you Bet and Checked, as the other options are actions after a donk lead. You want to find out how often you Bet out of the times you Bet or Check, so for me it’s 323/(323+141)=70%. For maximum accuracy, you can add the Check/Raise to the denominator, but for me it’s negligible.

I want to say that I c-bet the vast majority of the time when I hit a hand or a good draw out of position, the only exceptions being vs extreme shorts stacks who I think are going to go in or stack off lighter later on, or maybe if I’m tangling with a 90vpip megadonk or an overly tricky opponent. In position I still c-bet the vast majority when I hit, with the same exceptions as above and maybe sometimes if I have a good draw (NFD) and don’t want to get check/raised or would like to keep players in, or when I’m slowplaying a monster and they can improve to second best hands. I do not have any systematic ways of checking my good hands. LuckySOB threw out a statistic of c-betting 80% of the flops you hit; if I had to guess mine I’d say it’s closer to 95%. This basically leaves my checking range unprotected, but the flops I check are usually either too dangerous to check with made hands (ex: KJ8 2f HU), or they’re protected by the amount of players on the flop (if I check, the pot’s all yours if you can fold out the other 2 guys). This may be a leak, but I’d be interested to know how people are exploiting this and how checking made hands in the above situations can be profitable at my stakes. This will be a topic to revisit as I move up.

Now, let’s try and see the math of why you wouldn’t want to c-bet certain situations. My c-bets are around 3/4th of the pot (I usually c-bet on the higher side with made hands and on the lower side with missed hands), so we’ll use that for our calculations. The breakeven point for a 3/4 pot c-bet is 43%. The formula is 4x-3(1-x)=0, where x is the probability to win the pot, solve for x.

So when you c-bet without a hand, you must get them to fold more than 43% of the time to make this profitable. That’s a pretty easy expectation when you’re heads up, but what about when the pot is 3-handed, 4-handed, or more? In a 3-way pot, both of your opponents must fold enough so they collectively fold 43% of the time. Let’s see how often each one must fold, on average. We’ll assume the two events are independent, but since they’re really not (when one folds, the other is slightly more likely to have a hand), this will actually overestimate our fold equity. To compute the probability of two independent events occurring, you must multiply their probabilities together. Let’s say the two opponents play exactly the same, and will fold the flop to your c-bet x amount of time. Since there are two, and we’re looking to have combined fold equity of .43, the formula is: x2=.43, solve for x. The average player must now fold more than 66% of the time to make this profitable, quite a bit above the initial 43%. I’ll spare you the math for more opponents:

These numbers have a couple of flaws aside from the independence assumption. Firstly, if one of the players is looser than average, the other players must be even tighter. For example, if on a particular 3-way flop someone will only fold 50% of the time, the other opponent must fold 86% of the time. Another flaw is that you’ll be c-betting a lower % in relation to the pot with more players to the flop, because the monetary amount will “look” bigger to the unsavvy players and won’t give high enough implied odds for the better players. For example, if you’re only betting 2/3 in a 3-way pot, you only need everyone to fold 40% of the time, thus individually you need the average players to fold 63% of the time (a bit better than a 3/4 psb, though negligible). And if you can get away with a 1/2 pot bet, you only need to them to fold 59% each.

Now my plan was to calculate the odds of certain ranges connecting with the board enough to continue. Unfortunately, this is a much more complicated problem than I initially thought and so I cannot present any specific numbers at this time. I’ll try and find a calculator that does this, and if not I’ll consider making one (though it’ll be a tough project).

Anyway, let’s estimate some call percentages. Two unpaired cards will flop a pair or better 33% of the time, but not all pairs are created equal. Most players today will take a card off with mid pairs, even bottom pairs, plus there are straight and flush draws to consider. Pocker Pairs (PPs) will only improve to a set 12% of the time, but some players will peel a card off with them 80+% of the time.

It seems to me that a mediocre opponent who overvalues medium-strength hands will find a hand to continue with for hand strength alone roughly 35% of the time, a commonly used estimate. This means in a vacuum, it’s definitely +EV to c-bet every flop HU and often 3-way. However, constantly c-betting observant opponents will cause them to start to play back, either floating your or raising you right on the flop, which can quickly send your fold equity plummeting. Moreover, the better players already have some standards for bluffing, and worse players may very well, too. On the other hand, solid players usually aren’t looking to flop just any pair, so their calling range based on hand strength is somewhat lower. Their calling ranges may include medium to low PPs, SCs, and some broadways. That means on dry flops (K84), most of their range got no help so when they’re playing back, their range is fairly polarized (they probably either hit a set, or are on a steal).

Perhaps the easiest way to get this number is to use the Fold To Flop C-Bet on PAHUD. Solid players will, at my stakes, have this stat in the high 60s to low 80s, and it’s not uncommon to see higher from the nitty players. Weak players often have numbers in the 50s (meaning it’s unprofitable to c-bet them multi-way), and megadonks often have 30s (meaning you should rarely c-bet). Take this raw number and adjust it to the board. On a dry board, a low 80 solid player should be folding much more often, and his range should be fairly polarized. On a wet board, that same player might go down to a 60, and players who are high 60s may become 50s.

Additionally, seeing how players act before you is an obvious advantage. Some players, especially weaker ones, like to lead flops whenever they hit TP or MP to “see where they’re at”. Thus, players checking before you are less likely to have a hand. Couple this with the fact that you can steal the pot later by double barreling, and you should be more apt to c-bet once some players have already checked on the flop. Also, Observant player will be less likely to pull moves on you in multi-way pots, especially if there is a player still to act after them, so you can increase their fold percentage. Another thing to consider is if you’re last to act in a multi-way pot, people may put you on a steal if you bet, which obviously lowers their fold percentages.

I think as you play against more observant players, you have to begin to watch your ranges closer. For example, if I’m c-betting 70% and only hitting a playable hand 35% of the time, half of my range is air. You then need double barrels, turn checks with made hands, and re-steals to protect your c-bets.

I think against observant players, dry boards and low boards are no longer optimal, as they invite steals. Then you get into float steals and re-steals, which are beyond my area of comfort, and will be topics for the future.

The Continuation Bet

By: Joe "Dice" Danfield

A continuation bet is a continuation of preflop aggression. When one is first to open a pot, one is entitled to the role of the aggressor. Consistent with preflop aggression, it is commonplace in today’s games for the preflop aggressor to follow up his aggression with a bet on the flop. With continuation betting more prevalent than ever in today’s games, it is important to understand the factors that ultimately dictate a continuation bet. For those unaware of optimal continuation bet strategy, an ill-advised continuation bet can be a marginal to a money losing play. Rather than importing my thoughts on the subject onto this paper, I will rely on factual information to provide you with the logical train of thought when considering a continuation bet. As the famous saying goes, “Give a man a fish and he will eat for a day, but teach a man how to fish and he will eat for a lifetime.”

In the most basic sense, the continuation bet aims at completing one of two goals: to build the pot if you hit and to take down the pot if you miss. The first of the two goals is obvious. Value bet your made hands. This piece will focus on the trickier of the two goals, and that is taking down the pot when you miss.

The primary aim of the continuation bet should be to win at least 50% of the pots without a hand. When continuation betting with air, your hand is essentially a bluff and it should be treated as one. A bluff involves two major components: having a range of hands in mind that your opponent might have and betting enough to get your opponent to fold those hands. While in a hand you must decide which hands from his range you are targeting. Then size your bet to allow you opponent to correctly fold based on pot and implied odds. In bet sizing, the goal should be to bet the minimum amount it will take to get the job done. This provides one with the least amount of risk and the most on their return. The following table will demonstrate what percentage of the time you must win the pot with a particular bet size.

Half pot sized bet (PSB): must win at least 34% for +EV

¾ PSB: 41%

Full PSB: 51%

There is no formula to assess the optimal bet size. One must rely on unpredictability, assessment of board texture and opponent to comply with optimal continuation betting strategy. In a heads up pot, on a whiffed board, an example of unpredictability follows: 20% of the time a check behind, 40% of the time a ¾ PSB, and the remaining 40% of the time a 4/5 PSB. This randomization creates the effect of unpredictability, which will keep opponents off balance and constantly playing a guessing game. Finding the right amount to bet is not a scientific problem. It is a part of a constant psychological battle between you and your opponent in compliance with board texture. You must see the bet from the perspective of your opponents. In “No Limit Hold ‘Em: Theory and Practice” David Sklansky assess that one’s train of thought before making a bluff should be along the following lines: “If I bet $X, what range will my opponent put me on, what will he view his pot and implied odds as, and will he see his hand vs. my range as profitable?” Once again, there is no formula which will tell how much it takes to get the job done, because each case must be analyzed separately, yet one should chose the minimum bet size you think will win the pot with the least amount of risk.

A primary consideration for continuation betting is your current table image, or credit. Image or credit is another way of expressing your degree of fold equity you have at the table or with another opponent. When you first arrive at a table, you are given credit. In other words, when you sit down at a table your first goal should be to establish a good image. When one wins many hands without having to go to showdown or one does happen to show down a bluff, your credit (image) is negatively affected. Do not get all worked up when you start to lose credit. This is what separate good players from bad ones. A good player will simply adjust his range to conform to his credit. With bad credit one must tighten their preflop range and reduce their bluffing frequency. The advantage to having bad credit is that it will be easier for your big hands to get paid off. The disadvantages to it are that it forces you into playing a super tight game, very selective bluffing, which thus diminishes the value of position. On the other hand, with a good image you are afforded the luxury of more fold equity than normal. Good credit will allow you to open your preflop range and steal more pots. Do not get too carried away, though. If you have good credit and you are facing a strong line without much of a hand, send it into the muck- he has you beat. A good image will promote your opponents to play in a straightforward manner and we all know that predictable poker is our best friend. Switching gears based on credit becomes more important as you move up in limits. Honestly assessing your image/ credit will allow you to make clearer reads on your opponents intentions, thus ultimately allowing you to make better plays.

These are merely considerations for continuation betting with air. Remind yourself of the adage made famous by Lou Krieger: “Nothing works all the time in poker except value betting the nuts on the river. In any other situation there is a tactic that can successfully counter it some of the time.”

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C-bet:
Many professionals say it and I am a firm believer that 95% percent of the time the right play is simple ABC poker. C-betting is ABC poker. If you raise it up in position and get called you can profitably bet the flop when checked to when you didn’t connect. The problem that we all encounter are the players who don’t give up when we haven’t connected and knowing when we should or shouldn’t C-bet against such villains. This is where c-betting becomes non-ABC. I have not mastered this fine art but plan to begin intensive study. I believe the c-bet is most effective in position HU and I will use it 98% of the time unless I am facing a short stack aggressive player or a player who I know to have shown resistance. In such spots the c-bet has lost value and I shut down unless I connect or the texture of the board is in line with what I perceive my villain to believe my range is. Multi-way pots I am less inhibited to c-bet and I do so depending upon position and flop texture as well as preflop action. C-betting OOP, this is a trouble spot for many. HU I am firing unless I hate the flop and my villain is 50% fold to cbet. That said when I do fire and am called you have to double barrel with both air and made hands. This is where I segue into floating. I don’t believe most villains are actually applying such thoughts knowingly but essentially they are calling with midpair or a gut-shot in hopes you check the turn if you missed in which case they take the pot away. There are two ways to take the power back against such players, one is to double barrel with air the other is to check the turn with a made hand. Both of these tactics can be used in and out of position. Checking with a made hand in my experience has proven to be very profitable. More times then not my villain will bluff the river or call me light with a hand I have crushed that he most likely dumps on the turn. With that said you can see why double barreling is effective. A concept that is less talked about is cbetting after 3betting which I think you have to always do unless you are in a multi way pot. The size of your c-bet can be smaller in relation to the pot as the pot will be large due to the preflop action. I will commonly fire 2/3 pot with both monsters and air here. The power of your cbet post 3bet is even more due to the psychological effect of the 3bet. You have taken a stand an reraised which isn’t to be taken lightly by most. You are representing a big hand so why wouldn’t you cbet? Flop texture I believe is almost irrelevant unless you put villain on AK-AQ and an AK or Q is on the board and you are ready to check fold your under pair.
Floating:
(This is where I segue into floating. I don’t believe most villains are actually applying such thoughts knowingly but essentially they are calling with midpair or a gut-shot in hopes you check the turn if you missed in which case they take the pot away. ) A very powerful tool not to be over used. The float is best utilized when you have decided to call a preflop raise with a marginal holding such as 98 suited. The preflop raiser fires a cbet at you and you have missed or picked up a slim draw. This is where HUD becomes a powerful tool, you can take both his PFR and CBET #’s into account and decide from there. If he is cbetting 75% he isn’t hitting the flop every time he leads and you essentially call looking to take the pot away on the turn if checked to. Brian Townsend has wrote a brief yet precise article in Cardplayer mag on this topic. Floating is a tool I am less familiar with and have begun to incorporate into my game. Floating is something that I feel at 100NL and below(as this is my highest stake) can be utilized but the situation must be ideal. Stick to floating TAG or LAG players who you observe giving up on the turn to other non thinking floaters this is an indication that when they check the turn after a cbet you can successfully take the pot away from them. Look to float in position as floating OOP is an option but extremely hard to master. I prefer a flop check raise if I suspect the cbet to be weak.
This is no where near as in-depth and insightful as it can be. The UF2B will be experimenting and reading up on these two topics and reporting back our finding at the end of the week sometime. As DodgyKen stated if you want to drop us a comment with ideas or links please do. This is for us as well as you.
-Noeledge

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Continuation betting

Firstly, one of the most important things to consider is the texture of the flop. For example, a C-bet is much more likely to take the pot down on a K82 rainbow flop than a QJT flop with two hearts. It’s much more likely that someone will have a piece of the second flop, whereas it’s hard to call a bet on the first flop without a king. Flops like 763 are also flops that I don’t always bet because people tend to put you on high cards if you raise pre-flop, and a C-bet is less likely to work. This doesn’t mean that I’ll never bet dangerous flops – I take into consideration the other factors below when deciding whether to bet an action flop or not.

Another factor that’s very important is the number of players seeing the flop with you. If the pot is heads up, I’m much more likely to make the C-bet. If there are 2 or more players seeing the flop with you, I tend to only C-bet with a made hand (top/2nd pair) or a good draw.

When I say that I’d bet with a good draw, I’m talking about a flush draw and overcards, or a flush draw with a gutshot – basically draws with quite a lot of turn cards that I’m going to like to see, as well as draws that I can still play if I get check-raised. Now, if I flop just a gutshot, I might be inclined to check behind on the flop as I don’t want to be check-raised and not be able to take a shot at hitting the nuts. This can be opponent dependent, and I glance at their check-raise flop % to get an idea of if I’m likely to be played back at. When out of position, it makes it a little tougher to play because you can bet a good draw, miss the turn, and be in a tricky situation. I’d still make the bet hoping to take it down there and then though.

Another important factor is your opponent’s Fold to C-bet %. I like to have this on my HUD display as I use it a lot. If an opponent folds to C-bets more than 70-75% of the time, I’m going to be firing at pretty much every flop, regardless of texture. If they only fold to C-bets 50% of the time, or less, I’m going to be much less likely to C-bet against them (even in HU pots), and I’ll probably restrict it to just the best boards.

They’re my general ideas at the moment about C-betting. I feel that I C-bet a good amount of the time at the moment, and I also think I’m pretty good at spotting where it isn’t appropriate. One thing I’m looking to improve on this week is knowing when to fire a 2nd barrel. Against some opponents, though, you know that they’re calling your flop bet weak. This is fine if you have a hand (even as little as 2nd pair) and are in position as you can often bet the turn and check the river, or check the turn and call a river bet (after inducing a bluff). This isn’t really double-barrelling though in my opinion – this is just betting your hand for value against draws or worse hands. I only tend to double-barrel with nothing if the board changes in a way that looks like it obviously helped my hand.

I really want to improve on when I can fire twice with air and take it away from an opponent who obviously has a better hand than me (or an opponent that is trying to float). For example, if I raise and a TAG cold-calls pre-flop, the flop comes 972, I bet and he calls, it’s likely he has something like 88 or 66-33. This is the type of spot where I think firing twice might be successful as a lot of these guys will call once in case you have overcards and are just making the standard C-bet, but they’ll fold to further pressure. I also think that firing twice against a draw-heavy flop when the turn pairs might be successful as players are less inclined to continue with a draw once the board pairs.

Floating

This is definitely an area that I can improve on. I very rarely float – in fact the spots where I do float aren’t even really floats. An obvious example would be if I cold-called with a small pair and the flop was rags. Here I might call a bet on the flop and see if he checks the turn. This isn’t really floating though as I’m doing it based on the fact that I may have the best hand.

When I think of the difficulties I face when someone calls my flop bet and I have nothing or a marginal hand, it makes me think that you could almost profitably float the TAGs on 80% of flops. I’m not sure if I’m correct in thinking this, but I feel that the tighter TAGs are probably prime candidates for floating as they know how to fold a hand. I also think you really need to be in position to float as it relies on them checking the turn for you to bet.

I think good spots for floating are as follows:
· You’re in the BB and the SB open-raises. Any dry flop is probably good to float on.
· A TAG opens and you cold-call in position. Again, any dry flop is probably good to float on. Also, a flop with a draw may give you chance to float and bluff if a scare card hits.
· Any time you’ve cold-called and you flop some sort of weak draw. Floating is probably good here as you have another way to win if you hit your outs. With a stronger draw, raising would most likely be a better play.

So this week my main areas for focus are recognising spots where a double-barrel will be profitable, and finding good spots to float. I’m also interested in finding alternative techniques to prevent someone floating me (aside from double-barrelling). I’ll be reading any articles I can find on the subjects (feel free to post links in the comments if you find any), as well as discussing hands with the rest of the group, and posting any interesting/good/bad spots I attempted to double-barrel or float in.

; DODGYKEN

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Cbetting

Cbetting or continuation betting is continuing to bet the flop after you raised preflop in an attempt to take the pot then and there regardless of your hand. http://www.pokerhand.org/?1337423

Cbetting is like a bottle of JD, it's a good thing in moderation, but too much and you get all messed up. When we first learn to play, many of us are scared to make that Contiuation Bet (cbet) without a decent hand. We soon learn how often we miss flops though, and are playing too weak if we just give up when we miss. This is where cbettingcomes to play. By making a cbet we are getting 2 desired results. First, many times our opponenets miss the flop and will just fold to our cbet regardless of our handstrenght. Second, our opponents are notice us cbetting and will not always know if we hit or missed the flop, allowing us to get paid off more often when we do hit. My first experience with cbetting was so good, I became a cbet junkie, doing it 100% of the time regardless of position, flop texture, or opponent stack or stats. I soon learned that this was a way too bleed myself of all my chips. Cbetting is a wonderful thing, but it needs to be done correctly to work well.

When I first get to a table, I like to set an impression of a bigger LAG than I am. One way to accomplish this is to come in cbetting every hand. Sometimes this works for quite a few hands, and sometimes I get called or raised the first time. Either way, I like to come in cbetting 100% of the flops I PFR into until everyone quits folding. Then I adjust to my guide lines that I now have for cbetting. These include cbetting the following......

Unconnected flops such as K83 rainbow.....it's most likely to miss your opponent
Most Ace flops.....I like a bit smaller than normal cbet here. Most A holdings will always call, and most non A holdings will fold to a smallerbet here. My usual cbet with a flopped A is 1BB less than normal, but I also apply this to when I do have an A.
TAG/NIT players.......what the hell, they're tight, use it against them.
Players that fold over 65% to cbets (use this PT stat)......if they have a history of folding to cbets, then away we go.
Small flops such as 3 4 8 rainbow when the caller is UTG or MP......most players are playing larger cards from UTG or MP.
Draw heavy boards that I hit good or I have the draw myself.....I base my cbet on the strength of my draw. For intance, I'm not cbetting with my 9 7 when the flopcomes TJQ.
And 80% of the flops I do hit......don't cbet all the flops you hit, you become too predictable. Predictablity is the death of a poker player.

My guidelines for when to not cbet are pretty much the obvious opposites....

Draw heavy boards I missed......most opponents are drawing with or without odds, don't bother to cbet here. That said I do cbet 1BB larger with my good draws or made hands with draw heavy boards. For the same reason, most opponents will still go for draw without proper odds. Just make sure you don't give them implied odds by paying themoff when they do hit.
Muliway flops....most my cbets are into HU pots, but you will find certain situations that you can cbet into a muliway flop and it usually requires position.
Calling stations.....there's a reason they are called "Calling stations".
20% of the time I do hit.....don't want your opponents to think everytime you don't cbet, they can just take the pot away.

Once I start to use these, I of course alter my play throughout the session to adjust for the unique play of my opponents as you should with any part of your game. One thingI really watch for is the guy that likes to play any Ace. They are usually easy to spot, and of course I don't want to cbet this guy when an A does flop. Even if I hold an A myself I won't cbet often. I want him to fire away and convince himslef that his Ace is good. I also don't like to play for stacks with this guy with just my Ace and goodkicker. Too often I see this guy beat AK with A6 when he hits two pair. Keep the pots smaller with him when you are just on the A yourself, even with the better kicker. This holds true for many hands with donkey calling stations. They like to play a lot of hands and call down with middle pair, bottom pair, or even Ace high....BUT REMEMBER....they call down with those hands. When that guy is raising or calling large raises willing to play for stacks, he's not on middle pair.

Floating

Another important part of the game that goes hand in hand with cbetting is floating. Many people have different ideas on floating, but the true meaing of floating is calling with nothing with the intention of raising or betting after check on a later street to take it away. This is where you use you're opponents cbetting against him. Floating can be used well agianst opponents that like to cbet a lot. The following hand is one that is boarder line value bet and float ..http://www.pokerhand.org/?1337399

Here is a good example of an oppenent TRYING to float me due to how much I steal blinds and cbet. http://www.pokerhand.org/?1337299 This next hand I was floating in the sense that I planed on check raising the turn, but when he checks behind my river bet turns more into a value bet rather than a float. It does give an example of how a float might work though... http://www.pokerhand.org/?1337441

When a flop comes unconnected like mentioned above......K83....this is the time a cbetting player will almost always fire. This is also the time where you can float this player. Calling his cbet and then bet after he checks the turn or raise his 2nd barrel. Floating works well for the same reason cbetting works. Most times your opponent misses the flop, so now it's time to take it away from him.

Floating is something that takes a little more time and patience to do correctly, and gets more costly when done incorrectly. So take the time to see who is cbetting too often at a table, and target them with your floating bets. This is also something you don't want to do with as much frequincy as cbetting, but when you find a player this works on it is profitable.

I like to float players that have VPIP and PFR stats of a standard TAG or LAG with a small gap in those 2 stats. Players like a 16/12 upto around25/19. These are the players that are raising with a wide range that like to cbet as often as they can.....players like us acctually. If done in moderation, these players arenot usually going to play back at you without a hand. Again, floating is a part of you game you need to use in moderation. Unlike cbetting that which I think is beneficial at any level, floating is more level dependant. I don't think floating shouldn't be too much of your game at 50NL, but at 100NL you need to start working this into your game. At100NL it becomes profitable if used correct, but more importantly you need to use it at 100NL so that you can be ready for it when you move to 200NL.

Two of the largest diffences I've noticed from 100NL to 200NL is the amount of 3Betting and the amount of floating going on. When you know what changes to expect between levels, you need to parctice at your level prior to moving up. That way when you make the move, you understand and are familiar with the moves. It is just as important to realize who is floating and cbetting you as it is to do it to others. Succesful floating is one of the most satisfing ways to win a pot, but a horriable way to lose, so use it wisely.

LuckySOB